Contracts of Fleeting Passion

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Re: Contracts of Fleeting Passion

Postby Fetch » Thu May 05, 2011 8:30 am

My initial proposal is organized after old Fleeting Spring because that's the most used and (imo) best Fleeting Contract. I'm willing to kill the sacred cow if others are. Growth of the Ivy is kind of insanely powerful but it's also hard to pull off on long term Passions, at least on supernaturals. Even a -3 is harsh when being contested. On the flip side, yes, it probably should still be a higher dot clause.

On the subject of cross court manipulation I initially want to avoid it as that would, to me, be blurring courts. "You're the king of summer who hates me? Well now you love instead because Spring is awesome!" No, you don't get to mess with other court emotions out of the box.

That said a quirky idea I like has popped up. What if the fifth clause lets you use the earlier clauses cross Court, provided you know the clause for both Courts. So if you have Summer 2 and Autumn 2 then the fifth dot would let you turn fear into anger and visa versa. Kind of a form Contract with a single panicle Clause. Merging the level 1 of Summer and Autumn would let you show your anger at someone in order to see what they fear.

This would draw courtly emotion closer together but only for those who study it to the very peak. It would also emphasize that the Fleeting Contract was bound with something else, Emotions, Bedlam, or some such. This could be especially interesting if we make the first four clauses a little weirder and make them synergize with Bedlam.

Bedlam compels it's victims to act on a given emotion so if the first four dots focus on instilling, changing, and strengthening emotions then you can flip your subjects to Passions you like before forcing them to follow them with Bedlam. This look removes the need for Wake the Inner Fairy and makes the Contract subtler in itself.
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Re: Contracts of Fleeting Passion

Postby The Doctor » Thu May 05, 2011 9:00 am

I think the concept for the new level 5 has very good merit, I've yet to decide if I'd like it in the game.
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Re: Contracts of Fleeting Passion

Postby Delphinan » Thu May 05, 2011 10:11 am

Question: Mantle requirements for the courts are being said to be proposed as based on a certain percentage of Passions according to another thread. If these contracts change that, then doesn't it make it impossible to remain any level of advanced mantle as others will just keep switching it to make a target lose the mantle?

Also, given the current topic of this fifth clause, that usually required high mantle...would you need high mantle in both target emotions to use this alternate 5th?
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Re: Contracts of Fleeting Passion

Postby Fetch » Thu May 05, 2011 10:29 am

The existence of Moonborn dose not make it impossible to maintain Clarity. It just means if a Moonborn happens to dislike you they can give you derangements and hence force you to make Clarity degeneration tests every so often.

Going with a more pure approach you can only change emotions of the court in question to other similar emotions. Wrath is still wrath and fear is still fear.

If we allow cross court emotional manipulation then yes, it could be possible to attack someone's court tie supernaturally. You're Winter now but you won't be (as high) once I turn all your sorrow to Desire and Wrath. It gives good reason for a Courtier to have more then the needed Passions relating to their Court. Redundancy is good.

With the idea of allowing cross court emotional manipulation at Clause 5 we're talking about Courtiers with Mantle 4+ who get all 5 levels of their own Court's Fleeting Passion and then go on to invest 3+ dots of Goodwill in another court as well as 2+ dots of their Fleeting Clause. Not allot of changelings are going to meet those requirements and even if they do there's no guarantee they'll want to kill your court connection.
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Re: Contracts of Fleeting Passion

Postby Fox Folger » Thu May 05, 2011 10:30 am

The Doctor wrote:
Anywhere in this Contract that Court is referenced it must be the Court the Contract is bound with and anywhere a Passion is called for it must be one aligning with the Court.


It seems rather clear that each court can only affect their own emotions, it's what Lucas and I were arguing about before.


Missed that, sorry.
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Re: Contracts of Fleeting Passion

Postby The Doctor » Thu May 05, 2011 10:33 am

I'm assuming that's one of the reasons why (without the proposed 5th level), you can't switch passions off their set emotion, and can't fuck up someone's mantle, the whole blending the courts things aside.

As far as 5th dot, you need mantle-1 or goodwill+1 to get a contract, so the 5th level you can only get if you're of that court (okay, technically, you could join the court, get to mantle 4, buy up to level 5, then switch courts, and just spend the extra glamour to activate it...but yeah).
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Re: Contracts of Fleeting Passion

Postby Fetch » Thu May 05, 2011 11:31 am

Not making magically stripping people of their Mantle dots easy is a consideration, yes. I mean I'm not against it being possible at some point but it should be hard.
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Re: Contracts of Fleeting Passion

Postby Fetch » Tue May 10, 2011 10:27 am

Bodhisattva of Bedlam (•••••)
The greatest students of Passion find the distinction between one emotion and the next is meaningless, an illusion of lessor minds.
Prerequisites: Mantle (Court) •••• and at least two variants of Contracts of Fleeting <Court> •+
Cost: 1 Glamour
Test Pool: None
Action: Reflexive
Catch: The changeling possesses a Passion pleasing both Courts being merged.
Effect: The courtier may treat two Courts/emotions as being the same for the purpose of this Contract or when using or being effected by Bedlam. They must poses the chosen Clause for both selected Courts to use this enlightenment with this Contract and must posses both Courts variants of the second dot to use it with Bedlam.



Obviously this would be running in the direction of the Contract as being bound with Bedlam. We use actual Bedlam to work the uncontrollable emotions angle. I kinda like the emotional enlightenment aspect of this Clause.

That still leaves modification to the earlier Clauses, if we're killing sacred cows. Emotions being read and emotions changing make sense as dose waxing and waning altho in all cases not necessarily in their current form. However I also thing emotions should be shared and as thats another good angle to work with.
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